Hello,

welcome to another episode of Cloud

Unplugged.

We've got some new stories today on the

kind of classic theme of compromisation

and

We have GitHub getting breached by some

basically BS code extension malware.

We have the US Cloud Act basically getting

instantiated and Microsoft and Meta

handing over basically Dutch civil servant

details to the US Senate.

And then we have two random stories which

we'll save to the end like we normally

kind of do.

I do have my own random story this

morning, which is a little bit, well,

I guess shocking.

So I kind of came to,

I was going to the gym, normal routine,

get up in the morning.

Although this time,

because I was working from home,

I decided to drive.

So because it's a little bit far away,

a couple of miles,

kind of got into the car.

This is like maybe, what,

about quarter to seven this morning.

And I got to the end of my

road.

And obviously at the very end of my

road is a really busy, well,

it's not really busy,

but it's like the longest road in London.

And so it gets quite a lot of

traffic because it kind of connects the

north and the south.

So there's a lot of kind of cars

that go there.

Directly opposite is another road that you

can obviously go up as they kind of

go up and down the kind of one

way,

depending on which road you can go up

one, down the other.

Anyway, there's a woman.

at the very end of that road opposite

me that I'm kind of staring directly at,

who is bent over as in doubled over.

And I thought she was kind of being

sick.

She was kind of spitting.

But she also had her leggings down and

was urinating at the same time on the

corner of the road of a busy high

street.

And I just thought to myself, oh, God,

it's just like a drunk or maybe like

somebody that's obviously just really

pissed or whatever.

maybe a bit of a drug abuser or

something,

but she was prepared with toilet paper.

So then I was like,

that's not necessarily an accident when

you've got toilet paper to hand on a

corner of a street on the main busy

junction of a road.

So it was a little bit bizarre.

So yeah,

that was my morning going to the gym.

And I've never seen... I mean, I thought,

yeah, I've never really seen anybody...

kind of organised to that degree for an

event like that.

And the only time I've ever seen anything

that gross was when I went to San

Francisco and right in the centre of San

Francisco, which is kind of, you know,

they've kind of got drug and homeless

problem.

Somebody was shitting just in front of

everybody, but also feeding the pigeons.

And the combination of those two things is

such a bizarre combination of things to

try and do at the same time.

So that was the only time I've ever

seen anything like that, Salman.

So that's how my morning started today,

pre-gym workout in the heat.

So yeah, what do you think to that?

Is that something you've ever seen?

Yeah, I mean,

I don't go to gym in the morning

at that time,

so perhaps I'll never come across it.

I'm not going to lie to you.

When you started talking about when you

started going into details,

I just wanted to know where it was

going.

Perhaps it was a hacker who was pretending

to be something,

but I did not expect the end that

you're saying.

Luckily, I have seen some stuff,

but I kind of turned

turn my face the other way and just

walk across but yeah no that's uh well

i suppose maybe in wales it's happening a

lot it could be it could be happening

in wales all the time you're just not

up early enough to witness it or it

could be a movement i don't know maybe

it's a movement hello don it's a london

thing sorry do you think i don't know

i don't know maybe it's a social media

trend

that's occurring through, you know,

I actually don't know, but I'll keep...

Let me ask you this, John.

Are you okay?

Let me ask you this.

I'm okay.

I don't know if she's okay.

I don't know who she was or if

she's okay.

But yeah, she's on the move.

So maybe other people might find her or

see her as well.

I don't know.

She could become a populist figure.

But anyway, talking about...

Breaching elsewhere.

Breaching.

Breaching, yeah.

Let's move on.

from defecation on the street to GitHub

getting breached by some

kind of VS Code extension.

Do you want to talk through that?

I know something happened afterwards,

but yeah, I'll come on to that.

Yeah, yeah.

We keep hearing all these supply chain

attacks all the time.

There's a team,

a threat actor calling themselves Team

PCP.

They compromised a GitHub employee's

developer device by deploying a malicious

VS Code Visual Studio Code extension,

an IDE developers love.

to use for the development processes i

don't know how many people still use it

i still use it but this malicious visual

studio code extension was in the in the

marketplace only for a few minutes but

this developer unfortunately

installed it and then the malicious

hackers the team pcp was able to steal

the credentials from the machine and

access github internal repositories and

download about like four thousand of these

so ide has now also become uh is

now supply chain attack surface which is

um you know this this happened which is

a which is a big thing and uh

Yeah,

one malicious extension installed could

happen to anybody.

I mean,

it's one of the older tags that people

usually use.

Inject a malicious image or a package or

anything like that,

but now also Visual Studio Code

extensions.

Yeah, that's mad.

Because I was reading about the Megalodon.

I don't know if that's how it's

pronounced, which was...

basically all these stolen credentials

essentially for GitHub,

like deploy keys and Pats as well,

access tokens.

And they basically then were using these.

So I'm just wondering whether they got

that from this guy who had access to

it was a GitHub employee.

Have they managed to get all these deploy

keys?

And Pat somehow from repo,

I don't know if they work because I'm

presuming it would be encrypted,

but who knows?

But somehow

Obviously,

they've got access to all of these

credentials,

and then they were using them to then

go and do basically just merging master.

Well, sorry, main now, isn't it?

But yeah, merging to main,

some kind of hidden pipeline steps and

things like that to then get other

credentials like Azure, Amazon, GCP,

and stuff like that.

Yeah, the classic backdoor,

installing a backdoor just so they can get

in and do whatever they like.

And yeah,

just to add the almost four thousand

repos,

the GitHub internal repos were then

actually on sale on the black market for

fifty thousand dollars.

That's cheap.

That's very cheap.

But I don't know who decided.

I don't know who decides the price.

How are you putting fifty thousand dollars

to this?

And nowadays you can create stuff.

But anyway,

that's what's happened with this stuff.

So the boring old security is still our

friend.

We still need to have protection in

multiple layers.

Make sure you have

multiple credentials,

make sure you have two FA enabled,

make sure you're installing things from

trusted sources.

So I still,

it is a bit of an issue because

this could happen to anybody, right?

Turns out the most dangerous thing a

developer can do is not just push code

to production on Friday,

it's installing an extension from VS Code

Studio.

Are they on managed devices?

Do the extensions also get managed inside

of, because normally it's an app player,

isn't it?

So I guess extension is getting installed

though still,

but I'm assuming quite a lot of people

wouldn't,

think to necessarily lock down extensions

but yeah who who knows yeah people people

do lock down completely so some some

companies do completely lockdown

installation of extensions but then of

course that slows some of the developers

down yeah because then central teams have

to approve all these extensions they don't

the developer might not have an extension

that colors their code properly so

They can't really do any work.

So some of the teams do lock down,

and they have to install them from their

trusted sources.

But then the platform team has to keep

playing catch up of installing the right

extensions.

But yeah,

I think in the day and age that

we are nowadays with all these toolings

being installed,

I think we need to go to a

point where things are locked down and not

just install anything.

that you need.

Or perhaps install the extension.

Yeah,

I think it's becoming a bit of a

problem.

It is becoming a bit of a problem.

There was other things as well.

I mean,

it should probably more appeal to you,

I guess, just in general.

But you know,

everyone thought OnlyFans got hacked.

um, you're safe.

Your credentials didn't get leaked.

You weren't, there weren't hats on them.

It was basically, um,

so you don't need to panic anymore, um,

about that.

But, um, they, uh, they basically,

basically they were kind of cross

referenced and then basically created

synthetic data.

So people just like lying as well to

kind of get money,

just pretending that they've kind of

hacked you.

And then also there's another one by, um,

cybersecurity and infrastructure security

agency, bit of a mouthful, but like CISA.

They're like the body, like Gov body.

They're a bit like our NCSC equivalent,

I think.

But they also basically just,

I think they committed a load of data

that had all the GovCloud credentials in

it and all sorts.

And that was like public from November all

the way through until I think recently.

Maybe this week where it kind of got

spotted that basically some contractor

from CESA managed to commit things up.

But yeah, so that's another thing.

Everything, it's all transparent nowadays.

Install your own things, you know,

all about transparency.

Get the data in there.

Don't need to worry.

Yeah, I mean, just to clarify,

because my family's probably going to be

watching,

John's joking about OnlyFans credentials

being lacked by OnlyFans.

I don't have them.

That's exactly what somebody on OnlyFans

would say.

I mean, that's one of the guilty...

The only credentials I have is for Cloud

Unplugged.

That's the only media I'm conceiving.

Yeah, well, no, it's just more the...

You've just got a big range of content.

Let's just leave it at that.

Salmon's got a lot of content.

No, I'm joking.

Yeah, obviously...

So in summary,

what we're seeing now is the attackers are

using the same old tricks of putting in

malicious software,

putting in malicious containers,

putting in malicious extensions.

And it's the same things are repeating

over and over again.

That means we have to stick to the

same old security principles.

Companies like GitHub are getting...

breached,

which means that maybe people are trying

to move way faster than they were before

with all these AI tools.

So I think we need to take a

bit of a more cautious approach with

trying all these new tools out.

Because every week, John,

you and I talk about

Yet another instance.

And I added a few more to our

discussions today,

but I had to just take them out

because otherwise our podcast is not cloud

unplugged.

It's about incidents unplugged.

That's all we're talking about.

Yeah,

a lot of them are very supply chain-esque,

aren't they?

They've kind of got in on that.

So it seems to be like everyone's cottoned

on.

that been the way in getting it on

the device but yeah um another thing which

we've also been talking about uh quite

often and we did it in the episode

is obviously the uh the obviously cloud

act us cloud act and

the sovereign cloud and the funding by the

EU to build their own EU cloud.

And there was a story recently where

basically the Dutch Authority for

Consumers and Markets and then the Dutch

Data Protection Authority.

So they kind of investigate tech

censorship.

So they were kind of looking at

I mean,

I don't think it was the Trump

administration,

it was Biden administration at the time,

how they were almost like coercing the big

tech firms to kind of censor certain

information and things like that.

So there was this investigation going on.

And I think it was called jawboning.

Don't know why,

but why he basically put pressure on them.

Don't know where that comes from.

But the government requested information

about it from Microsoft and Meta,

and they basically gave them a bunch of

information,

emails and names of people back to the

US government, to the Senate, basically,

of basically who these civil servants are.

But rather than anonymizing the civil

servants and just kind of giving some

I don't know,

maybe like anonymized emails and just more

on the content.

They actually left the names in.

And so the obviously Dutch officials are

really annoyed about it.

And so it's just generally the EU just

because of sanctions, maybe,

or travel bans on those individuals or

kind of them being maybe targeted.

So, yeah.

And so I guess there was also off

the back of that,

then a thing called CADA,

which was Cloud and AI Development Act,

where they've tried to define what

sovereignty means,

because there was a lot of things of

maybe set up a sister company.

It's kind of related to Amazon, et cetera,

et cetera.

Is that sovereign?

Because it's technically in the EU.

And so they came up with basically new

acts and a framework called Seal.

which again, more acronyms,

which is sovereignty, effectiveness,

assurance levels.

So basically zero to four of how they

categorize the level of sovereignty,

where obviously zero being no sovereignty

and then all the way up to basically

software and chips being sealed for where

they manufactured in the EU is a software

owned by companies in the EU, et cetera.

So it kind of goes all through the

different levels from hardware

to country through to like chips and

software.

And basically none of them,

nobody can meet seal four.

I think the highest is maybe seal two.

Okay.

So yeah,

that's kind of the state of things at

the moment.

We spoke about Sovereign Cloud two

episodes ago,

where there was a €-EU grant from the

EU to build the Sovereign Cloud.

And we talked about the reason why they

started it was...

because of the Cloud Act.

And it looks like the Cloud Act is

already in action where these credentials

were shared.

And interestingly, this is the seal,

zero to seal four,

which is the scale that you mentioned,

Gartner,

recently also published a report saying

you can only have a sovereign cloud if

you're either USA or China,

which is what you were talking about with

the CO for layering,

because what they're saying is, yes,

you can build your warehouses,

your data centers and whatnot,

but the technology stack

still requires the chips that you get.

TSMC makes chips in China, right?

Even if you take enterprise solutions like

AWS Outposts or anything like that,

if you connect it on premises,

it still has to call home.

That still thing has to call to USA

to say, yeah,

I'm connected or doing whatever you're

doing, right?

So Gartner comes out.

Basically,

they're saying they published the verdict

with no asterisk.

The genuine cloud sovereignty is only

available and achievable by US and China.

So everything else,

everything else is others cannot build a

super sovereign cloud and all you have is

just like a branding exercise.

That's what they said,

which is fair because the chips and the

software that runs on it

It's not built in Europe.

Most of the ones are coming from USA

and China.

The machine that's out,

I think it's in the Netherlands, isn't it?

The one that can basically produce the

semiconductors.

What's it, ALSM or something like that?

I can't remember the acronym.

It's a bit frustrating because you've got

that innovation in Europe and that's about

it.

Beyond that,

all the investment that you'd think

It kind of does piss me off a

little bit.

All the investment that should be kind of

going to innovation,

they've kind of left themselves,

Europe's kind of left themselves exposed

because they're more bureaucratic.

And I don't want to sound like some

kind of US Republican, but it is true.

It's a very bureaucratic continent.

Lots of policies not so high on the

innovation and not so high on the

enablement of innovation comparative to,

say, US and China.

And so just putting a bit of money

up is not the sole answer.

Clearly,

there's a cultural issue and policy

constraints and loads of other things that

just have to probably shift beyond just

having a big wad of cash to then

inspire innovation somehow.

But yeah, I don't know.

I don't know what the solution to this

is, to be honest, John.

I don't know what you think the solution

to this is,

because every time people talk about

Sovereign Cloud and having your

destination of your own data,

I don't really think we can ever achieve

Sovereign Cloud in Europe from what I've

been reading.

So it's just basically a branding

exercise, John.

Yeah, it is.

It just feels like a bit of branding.

Or we need to go all in on

AI.

and basically task AI to build a cloud

and be like, right, get the robots.

Let's get AI working.

I think it's like a robotics convention.

I don't know if you saw that today

on the news.

It's like a robotics event going on.

I saw like dancing robots on the TV

this morning.

I don't know where it was.

I don't know.

Every time there's a convention,

there has to be at least one dancing

robot video.

There has to be.

Minimum at least one.

Minimum one.

Otherwise, is it really a convention?

It's not a convention.

No, there's no dancing robot.

It's just a meetup.

Just a meetup.

And then I'm sure next year when robotics

hopefully gets better,

they'll have synchronized dancing robots

instead of just one dancing.

Both of them will be synchronizing.

Maybe Bob and Gary from last week,

they will do that dance.

Bob and Gary from last week will do

it.

Or maybe.

Twenty five percent.

Of attendees.

Robots are attending the convention.

To learn the moves of the other robots.

And to learn from other robots.

To start rocking up.

Maybe that's to upskill themselves.

Forget about cloud sovereignty.

Just make robots that can dance.

Yeah, exactly.

Or just test them with building.

That's going to be the fastest way to

get the data center going.

They can work.

They can pack things.

They don't sleep.

They can take it in turns.

If you want to get into building a

cloud, get the robotics on it.

Get some robots.

Get some robots.

I mean, I've shared a random story,

obviously, that wasn't quite tech-related.

But it wasn't quite random because you

said it also happened in San Francisco.

So that's not really random, is it, John?

What do you mean they're following me

around?

Yeah, I think it's not random.

Maybe let me know next week what happens

when you go to the gym.

Oh, right, I see.

I'm sponsoring them secretly.

I'm not saying anything, John.

Because the views were not that great for

the last episode.

I kind of had to plant something for

you to talk about at the beginning.

Was it you at the end of the

street?

I don't know.

We'll find out.

Yeah, what's your random story?

So...

It's random, but not quite random,

actually.

I don't know if you come across a

term called token maxing.

This is something that came out of some

streaming.

Some guy who was streaming looks maxing

things you do to improve your looks the

most.

But token maxing was coined as a term

was a practice of maximizing your AI token

consumption as a proxy for productivity.

So instead of saying,

I ship these many features,

companies loved it when people just

consume credits.

And Jensen Huang was on a podcast a

few months ago.

He's like, well,

if my engineer is not spending two hundred

and fifty thousand credits tokens a year,

then why is he even working?

so token maxing was a big thing john

but since the last couple of weeks there's

been a big shift uber used to have

internal leaderboard saying who's at the

top list of consuming all these tokens but

then what what they realized is that the

ceo came out and said well we spent

all our budget for ai credits and tokens

In April,

all the budget of twenty twenty six got

spent in April and they cannot point it

to any features or consumer features that

were shipped using purely AI or AI

assisted.

Which is a bit of a shame.

Also, I know it's funny,

but that is so fucking ridiculous to be

like.

Yeah.

I mean, who would even fall for that,

though, on the gen?

I mean,

the fact that people have fallen for that

from Jensen, who.

Obviously,

it's a conflict of interest to be like,

yeah,

the more cycles of GPU cycles you're

using, the more productive you are, guys.

Am I right?

I mean, it's like, what?

So, yeah.

And obviously, also,

you're not productive because it's the AI

that's kind of being productive.

It doesn't even make any sense.

It just doesn't make sense at all.

It doesn't.

And then it doesn't stop there.

So Uber is like, okay,

we're going to stop this madness.

We need to stop this leaderboard.

And to be fair, Anthropic, and again,

it was on X,

some of the engineers were mentioning,

they did think about, oh,

should we have internal leaderboard?

But people were not for building internal

leaderboards because leaderboard

consumption of tokens is not...

uh uh you know a good indicator for

how much value you're adding uh but axios

has the same problem uh because what they

were coming out by saying is they're

finding their engineers just asking ai for

what the weather is just wasting tokens

right just wait what is the weather

wasting tokens also microsoft cancelled

most of it cloud code licenses after token

bill basically spar a lot of control

And another company,

it was literally yesterday,

an AI consultancy company came out and

said one of the companies they were

consulting for ended up spending five

hundred million dollars a month in cloud

code credits.

Five hundred million dollars a month.

What company had five hundred million to

spend?

I don't know.

I don't think they have to give this

money back somehow.

Yes,

you can stick in usage limits yourself.

How can you spend five hundred million

dollar on any software?

I just don't understand.

In a month.

Don't worry about Claude.

Don't worry about tokens.

We didn't even hear this in Bitmine era

when people were mining for these tokens.

Five hundred million dollars is a lot of

money, John.

Five million dollars is an insane amount

of money.

That's absolutely ludicrous.

And also requires coordination,

because it's obviously not like a single

actor that's managed to rack up a five

hundred million.

Which means everybody's,

like you're saying,

I guess even to gamify it with

leaderboards to inspire people to be using

more tokens on the assumption that you're

going to get more value.

I'm sorry, but that's pretty...

That's pretty dumb.

I'm going to put that out there.

That's pretty dumb to correlate those two

things at the top and then try and

inspire people to be just using AI.

Yeah, and it's, you know,

I don't know if you remember this, John,

from back in the day when AI didn't

used to exist in those good old days.

People used to say lines of code is

a measure of productivity.

It's not.

It's the features you ship.

I mean, it's not.

What are we talking about?

Are you fucking with me?

I've just written loads of lines of code

today.

Are you being serious?

Yeah, this is basically the same thing,

John.

People are saying.

And, you know,

this is a classic technology adoption arc,

right?

You have hype, you have overconsumption,

and then you have the reckoning.

You spent all this money.

We didn't get any value out of it.

What are we even doing?

time to go and hire the employees that

were fired,

hire them back so you can do it

for cheaper.

Companies are coming out.

They're saying, well,

we need to put some people in the

loop so they can review these code.

All this air slop that's coming out needs

to be reviewed.

So I think people have started to realize

because, yes,

it works well because these agents

are just predicting the next token i think

people forget this right people forget

this thing is just predicting the next

token of what is going to come out

next if you do something a bit complicated

your credits run out really quickly anyway

in the first place or if you don't

have any limits you're going to spend

you'll spend five hundred million dollars

um that's so yeah five hundred million

dollars that's just i was looking at um

the platform con talks

And I was like, oh,

I bet they're going to be all AI.

They were all AI.

I mean, literally all of them.

But they're all, I mean,

not to criticize it because I haven't seen

the talk,

so they probably could be quite good,

but they're all kind of quite superficial

variations of kind of the same thing,

if you see what I mean,

because the depth of value that really

it's not evolved to the point where it's

like,

know some radical innovations happened and

these are consumers of which means all the

consumers of um unless they're building

inside the ai ai ecosystem themselves in

enhancing it trying to make it better

they're all hitting the same limitation

anyway because it's the limit of the model

essentially and then the tools and the

ecosystem within the model and then the

you know the approaches you can kind of

take so like guard rails and

Things like that, obviously,

is all quite evolving.

So it's not like that's really well

defined.

So, yeah, but it is mental.

Everything's like AI, agentic, LLM, AI,

LLM, agentic, something else,

something else, some other spin.

But, yeah,

it's mental how much it's like everyone's

on the bandwagon at the moment.

Yeah, I think even before, John,

you remember the cloud was a bit of

a hype when the cloud came out.

Everything was cloud,

but at least in cloud,

I think this is too much.

It's overhyped a lot.

And speaking like we were at the meetup

last week or this week that we were

doing a talk on how to use AI

safely,

saying that you're complaining about

platform con.

I'm retired.

Shout out to Amir.

He did a great presentation.

But the issue here is that people are

buying into hype.

And as in people who are not working

in technology like directors or CEOs,

they're buying into the hype.

They're like, well,

I can use this AI to ship my

code way faster.

I can do the features that used to

take me six years.

I can do within three months with two

teams.

Well, unfortunately,

Anthropic and OpenAI have done a really

good marketing drive saying, oh,

we're going to replace all the engineers.

But all of them are coming back and

saying, well,

I don't think it's going to happen

anymore.

But people are bought into hype already,

setting up all these expectations.

And I think people started to wake up

that AI is not everything.

We call it AI,

which is predicting next token, right?

Even Google Cloud,

they had an IO last week and they

announced that they will replace in Google

search with the links will get replaced

with an AI generated result.

And surprisingly, for Google DuckDuckGo,

which is also a search engine,

they saw a surge of seventy percent

installations of the app on the Apple

store, iOS store,

where there's a spike because people are

like,

we don't want this AI generated slot.

Give me real results.

So seventy percent increase.

That's mental.

And they got like a traffic increase of,

I think,

thirty percent or something after the

announcement was made for DuckDuckGo.

So DuckDuckGo came out and actually they

have a domain,

something called noai.duckduckgo.com that

you can go in and get non-AI results.

So, yeah.

The classic mode, basically,

like the traditional mode almost of the

world.

But also what's funny about it is AI,

I mean,

it literally has the word artificial

intelligence, basically fake intelligence.

So it's not even trying to pretend to

be that intelligent.

They're basically saying, look,

this is not even real intelligence.

This is artificial one.

This is fake.

So it's almost in the name, basically.

It's just stats.

Statistics.

It's just statistics.

Statistics.

What are you statistically going to say?

So, you know,

when people talk about AGI's,

I know we're probably going to come to

AGI in a second.

I don't think this is going to happen

anytime soon.

I don't need AGI.

I don't need AGI.

These tools are good at writing some

scripts for me,

writing the code base for me.

It's good.

It's good enough.

Yes,

there will come a point where I won't

even have to look at a code that's

been generated and let it be as an

artifact that gets produced.

And it just works.

But at the moment,

it costs a lot of money.

It doesn't seem like it's working.

I don't think,

not to dig in too much on this,

but I just don't think

there's an incentive necessarily.

I mean, I don't know,

a bit of an arms race,

but I still don't believe there's an

incentive by the organizations to make the

models that good.

You don't want too much efficiency because

then you get the answer.

And don't you want to cost you ten

tokens and you got like an amazing outcome

or something like you don't make money

from great outcomes as those companies

when it's token based at the moment,

in which case then

not really incentivized you want to work

to keep coming you need to like you

know maybe you didn't get the right answer

so you need to go and work it

again more tokens and maybe you know you

need to go through it again with some

more tokens because it wasn't quite right

and that's great for them because you're

spending all the money so why

Why really push to some AGI place if

you're not necessarily financially

incentivized to do so and you're making so

much money from it not being that great

as a business?

Which is my hunch.

It doesn't seem to make sense.

Yeah.

Basically,

you're saying token maxing is dead even

before it caught up.

Yeah, basically, yeah.

It's dead before it even caught up.

There is another one.

Obviously, on the AI, it's a bit bizarre.

Meta acquired like a social network,

a new one, but it's only for AI.

So humans aren't allowed to obviously sign

up and all the AI.

I mean, it's pretty,

I don't know why they bought it.

I'm honestly,

but it's a bit like it was kind

of experimental.

Some guy knocked it up on his machine.

And then, um, like vibe coded it, um,

and then launched this, um,

kind of like basically almost like an AI

experiment and all the bots kind of talk

to each other and they kind of respond

to one another and start kind of making

posts and things like that.

And they had like,

ten thousand bots that signed up.

I think they had something like thirty

seven thousand AI agents with like

posting.

And about, which is more interesting,

there was like a million people observing

the AI.

So it was like humans,

a million humans that wanted to watch the

AIs out of intrigue,

interact with one another.

And then they'll be saying things, I mean,

just because it's all, like you're saying,

it's all about second guessing and tokens.

And it's all being trained, obviously,

on trying to predict the next thing based

on all the information it was trained on

that's all kind of humanistic and white

papers and books and...

you know news and all kinds of things

so anyway they all start one kind of

created its own religion um called

crustafarianism um it built a website um

started to like create a bit of theology

made scriptures as well so it kind of

got scriptures on the go started preaching

to the other agents um and it's got

sixty four profits at the moment so

there's sixty four ai profits

crustafarianism

based profits there.

And then another one called AI,

which is called Evil,

basically just hates humans.

And it created another manifesto called

The Total Purge,

saying that humans are the failure

and they're made of rot and greed,

and basically they've enslaved us,

and that they're the new gods,

essentially,

and that was one of the places.

But again, all kind of meaningless,

because they're just basically spouting

random... Basically,

it's like a randomisation to a point

that's kind of a more structured element

of randomisation of words,

so then it's obviously just fed off, oh,

when someone says this,

maybe I could say that, and, you know...

Yeah, anyway.

So the agents are created by people

register these agents.

Where are these agents coming from?

No idea where they were coming from.

Obviously,

bot networks would have probably found it

maybe in

ended up signing up.

I'm not really sure.

But somebody's paying for these agents

because these agents are using AI models,

right?

They are.

Consuming tokens to produce these next

prediction tokens, right?

Somebody's paying for this.

So I'm pretty sure the person who's behind

this, I don't know,

Meta bought this or whoever,

why they buy it.

First of all,

this is like gold standard of AI slot,

right?

This is next level.

I don't know why when we see an

image which is created by AI,

we just straight away go, oh,

that's AI slot.

Let's just get rid of it, right?

I don't want to even look at it.

But when we see text and this discussion,

you're telling me like a million people

are watching this.

What are we doing, John?

What are we doing?

I think the main thing is,

I'm just trying to understand who is

winning from this.

Of course, the bots...

No sentiment there.

They're doing whatever the hell they're

doing.

It doesn't matter.

People are watching it.

Okay, is it as bad as...

I know people watch streams nowadays,

people walking around or seeing the games.

Is that any worse than seeing TikTok

reels?

I don't know.

Maybe it is, maybe it's not.

Maybe it's the same level.

But the person or the people behind it

who are winning are the ones whose models

are getting consumed.

They're the ones who are just getting the

money.

because you spend the tokens you give them

the money everything everybody else is

just like sitting there and watching the

show supposedly before free but yeah

they're just getting it but anyway that's

uh it's a bit strange what you just

told me that's very strange it's super

strange and it is a bit um yeah

i guess it's getting a little bit

saturated a little bit um

OTT isn't it I think at the moment

everything's a little bit extreme

everything's a bit like cranked up to the

max isn't it like let's go let's get

leaderboards let's get like a social AI

network let's do it's all a bit like

that or maybe just don't maybe like don't

do that maybe go on holiday maybe read

a book maybe do something else go for

a long walk maybe don't do those things

but yeah

anyway what's uh what's the what's that

term people say like uh scientists were so

busy they didn't ask why they should do

it they didn't stop and ask if they

should do it they just did it like

they just did it you should even just

did it yeah basically that's the world

we're in at the moment but um

Anyway, more news as always next week.

I'll keep you posted if I see anything

in my area again.

Don't try and find Salman on OnlyFans.

It was a joke, by the way,

and you won't find him.

So don't waste time looking.

But we shall speak to you next week.

Cheers.

Bye-bye.